Today we look at the differences between psychological development and understanding your biology. We’ll see how one impacts the other and where they converge to provide us the best opportunity for growth in every aspect of our life.
All right. Welcome back to mindset radio. I’m your host Jeff Banman. And today we are going to look at the war between biology and psychology. And what I mean by that is, you know, in the communities there’s been for a long time, there’s a huge disconnect between the two. And you know, science hadn’t really gotten to a place where we understood the body at the depth and level that we now understand it, right? We weren’t able to measure certain things, look at certain things, clearly identify certain aspects of stuff. And, you know, over the last 15, 20 years, I mean a dramatic growth and science and the ability to look inside the body itself and to begin to understand, uh, uh, how things are working, the interaction between the mind and the body, uh, or what we perceive as the mind and the body, right? The, the difference between the narrative and sensation.
And there’s, there’s been, uh, just this radical, massive kind of, you know, I’m going to stand my ground in a lot of ways for so long that it has permeated into the way we can operate even. It’s put some real restrictions in capacity for taking care of ourselves, for being more resilient, for being recoverable, for operating at a different level. You know, all these things. Or earlier this week, you know, we kind of had a, an opening conversation about opening Pandora’s box. Again, we’re going to kind of continue that conversation, right, because this has been this experimental growth over the time that I’m really committed to sharing with you all. And I think the cool thing for me is one being on the knowledge end of it. Right. Having previously done, I mean, I’ll be honest with you, like when I w after the work, uh, at the agency and after really discovering a lot of the human behavior stuff and the human performance issues and doing all the biofeedback work and the deep dive work on her rate variability and all this stuff before it was ever popular.
Um, you know, I felt like I was good. I felt like I was good, like I knew a lot. Um, and I felt like I knew myself pretty well. Like if you had met me back then, um, she may or may not have liked me. Uh, but I felt like I was good. Uh, no, I’m good. I like I got it, I got myself covered and uh, and I didn’t clearly as of today, uh, that would, that would not be the case. Uh, so uh, but this has been interesting because I feel like in this, in this kind of new realm for me, what I got to do was not only be the observer and be the, the analyst and be kind of the geek around this stuff, but I actually put myself in the condition and I actually got to test and experience the different layers along the way.
And so much like I told you on Tuesday, there is not a, a pathway for this. There’s not a do this first then that I don’t, I don’t know what that is yet. Like that will take some time to really string out to say, Hey, listen, if you did this and this and this and this, then maybe you might end up here. And that’s always a, maybe might end up here because you are going to take things on the way you’re going to take things on, see things where you want, and you have a whole different spectrum than I do. Uh, and so I think just kind of coming in to these conversations with that knowledge, um, is huge, right? I don’t have an answer for you. I have more questions I have, you know, my thoughts. I can share my experience with you. Um, but I don’t want that to become your experience either because we’re so individualized and, and, and so, uh, so different.
So, you know, I just want you to carry that into these conversations that we have. Kind of that quote unquote disclaimer, um, you know, but ended the topic here, you know, forever or forever. For a very long time. The biggest tool that we had was talk therapy, right? Was, was fundamental psychology because the only known capacity was that there was a stupid little voice running around in our head and it seemed to control the world. And it seemed to be the thing that mattered. And it seemed to be the thing that, you know, drove us in different directions. Um, and, you know, so we set out on this track of how do we manage this thing? How do we control this thing? What do we do with this freaking voice in our head that we have labeled now as our mind? Right? Our thoughts, uh, and you know, and then in some realms it was like, okay, where does that thought and what, how does that create feeling?
And then what’s feelings are there? What emotions are there? Um, and you know, so there’s been a lot of different components around the idea of talk therapy, you know, of course then you’ve got an LP, neuro linguistic programming that’s out there. Um, you know, or then you go to the old, you know, idea of it’s mind over matter. If you don’t mind, it doesn’t matter. Uh, and you know, and that kind of sits in that realm of psychology, right? The, the knowledge of what we’re doing, how we’ve experienced what we were experiencing, what’s going on at different points in times, uh, how all that is working or not. So, you know, when we look at this, I feel like sometimes, you know, we’ve had this idea that one is better than the other and that it is this battle. That’s why I’ve kind of framed it this way, that there’s some fight between, um, the, the, the aspect of it, the talk therapy that need to talk through your feelings, talk about your stuff.
Uh, I do feel like some of that can even promote some of it if it’s not done in the right way. And so that’s one of the areas I don’t want to talk about today. Um, but then this flip side, which is the total body side, right? Uh, which for a long time really was kind of the hippy dippy stuff. That’s the meditation practice. That is the understanding of, you know, trauma lives in the body. That’s the understanding that, you know, there is this big old elephant that’s all they want is familiar, right? That my body is this, uh, this sense of, you know, garbage that I don’t need. And somehow if I just say these words to myself, I can overpower that. And you know, going back, you look at Buddhist stuff and I said it earlier, you know, this week, I’ll say it again.
I’ve said it a million times, right? Great. Buddha was good. We’re just a big old Indian elephant trying to be controlled by a bunch of monkeys on top. And you know, sometimes those monkeys grow into gorillas and you know, there’s a time and a place for that where we need that kick in the ass. We need to kick ourselves, especially in our worlds where we need to tell ourselves to suck it up. We need to tell ourselves to push forward. We need to find that extra drive internally. But if you go back and look at that, that’s like a signal. It’s a shot from the mind into the body to move into action. And so, you know, that’s where these things begin to converge. And what what I see is because some of them have been isolated, you know the, the deep dive body work or the trauma healing or the energy work, you know all that stuff that seems ooey gooey woo LA LA crap over here is actually highly valuable because when I can align my, my mind and body that is where flow occurs and so on.
To talk about that for a minute because for a very long time we had this idea, a lot of books about it, you know, all the big conversation about how do I get in the flow I need to get into flow state. You know, and we felt like flow state only came at a certain point in time at a certain regulation. At a certain point of arousal, you know the body dropped into flow. What is flow? What is it functionally and it is truly nothing more than where the body mind and systems are aligned. That’s it. Where everything is actually working in sync. There’s everything is in coherence. There’s not a break in the cycle. My thought pattern isn’t fighting against my body to achieve something or my body isn’t pushing back against my mind. You know, in certain ways, everything falls into sync. Now your body will naturally do that under heightened States of arousal, right?
Under a key stress points. And you in this community, you’ve experienced it, right? I used to both firetruck going into the fire. You’re probably in flow more than likely, right? When things just become easy and seamless, you know, or you know, you’re chasing a Jason, somebody you know, down the street in a patrol car and you know, your roof hyper-focused, you’re super connected, everything seems, you know, time seems to slow down. You’re just kind of in that state of quote unquote flow that’s available in a whole spectrum of, of places. Um, and so you know that from the operational capacity and even be in flow at home, right? Being connected, that’s what we’re talking about. So if we look at it and kind of change the dynamic around it to something that I have to do to obtain flow, you know, guys will get out and chase stuff all the time.
Or I’m an end quote unquote adrenaline junkie. No, you’re looking for that, that, that connection, that, that real connection to what is happening and that hyper focus capability, that ability to be super present to the conditions around you. Cause it feels good when you’re there because it is primal. It is real, it is highly valuable. You know, you’re actually in your best state in that point in time because there’s no interference from outside influences or noises or noises in your head. There’s no internal influence. There’s no external influence. You’re just there in that moment. And it’s, it’s amazing. It’s absolutely amazing. And so when we begin to converge biology and psychology, when we stop, when we stopped fighting, when we stopped trying to separate out the mind and body, the narrative and the sensation, you know, the emotion and the action. When we begin to, when we stopped trying to push those things into their own separate corners and we just allow them to come together, we actually begin to understand ourselves in its entirety and begin to be able to use the systems the way we need to use the systems.
So, you know, let’s take a look at it. Is talk therapy bad? No, not at all. Not at all. Because that’s our vehicle to awareness and awareness creates moment of insights and insight creates a new look or an option, not an opportunity to observe. And when we can observe, we then find access to new actions. We’re able to take on new actions or new behaviors. And so that becomes the pattern, right? That becomes the pattern in which we operate with. So you know, he’s going to see a psychologist, a bad thing. Fuck no, it’s not. It’s a good thing. Especially if they’re good and they understand how to direct you to that new level of awareness, that new observation pattern. Right? So talk therapy. Not a bad thing. Great thing. Highly valuable. But do I need to go in and relive stuff all the time?
Do I need to constantly go through things? No, you don’t. Um, you know, the therapy, it should be actionable in all context. And so, you know, that’s why I think there are not, there’s not a huge resource pool for those of us in our community who can see somebody who is a highly knowledgeable, you know, this is my opinion, highly not knowledgeable, understanding and actionable, you know, psychologist, uh, out there who can really help put us into action, who can help blend our worlds and see what’s there. So, you know, no, not a bad thing. Neuro linguistic programming, bad thing. No, I don’t think so. I think it can be highly valuable, especially in our world, especially when you take a look at how to restructure or put new mental constructs around our thought patterns around our observations, around the interpretation of the processing of information.
Again, it’s not the end all be all. It’s not the solution to everything. It’s not the thing that’s gonna you know, change you dramatically tomorrow. I know that there are some out there that believe that, you know, NLP is like the end all be all master of the universe kind of stuff. I don’t see that. It’s not the case in my world at all. You know, again, it becomes kind of a tool in the toolbox. It becomes a way to, you know, restructure patterns that, that we’ve created over time. A way to communicate differently, communicate differently with ourselves. Uh, look at what, uh, what the narratives are that we’ve created, right? That voice in the head and how it runs. Uh, and it gives some tools to help be effective in utilizing that. So not a bad thing, but not the end all be all, uh, definitely something to utilize as you see fit in some ways.
So, you know, if you’ve never done that, are you curious about that stuff? You can take a look at it. You all will share with you, you know, if you haven’t looked at it, that can be a rabbit hole, um, that you can go down and spend a lot of time around. Uh, and it gets, it definitely gets woo in a lot of ways. And um, but you’re smart and you can pick and choose and you can be observant around what it is and understand what it is for the tool and the resource that it becomes. So that’s a huge thing to it. And then you’ve got like the gritty stuff, you know, the suck it up, drive on, you know, the mind over matter though. The only easy day was yesterday. Like, you know, drive on the freaking objective, right. Though I’d be the lone survivor.
You have all of those things that are out there, these are all mental constructs. Those are all, you know, key trigger points you that especially if they resonate with you and, and are, can become kind of part of the value system you operate under can be highly valuable, right? You just need to know when to use it. You know, you shouldn’t be sucking it up when you’re hanging out at Walt Disney world with the kids, but you’re, you know, overwhelmed and inundated by the crowd and nervous and looking around and full of anxiety and everything else. That’s not a suck it up time. That’s a breathe and release time. You know what I mean? Like, and I’m only saying that because I’m speaking about myself, uh, in that context, right? So, uh, you know, understanding where to use it and how to use it and how to leverage it is huge, right?
So this is part of, we’re all these things. There’s actually, when we look at it, there’s so much good stuff out there and there’s so many good things that have come from, you know, the unknowns, right? The people that are just trying to impart some sense of how they achieve something and that comes out in a very slang term or a saying or something, right? There’s massive value in that stuff. But again, it’s not where you hang your hat. It’s not the only thing that exists out there. And that’s part, you know, we, we often attached to one or two things that helped drive us through something significant in our lives. And then that becomes the thing we hang our hat on and that becomes the, our stake in the ground. And the problem is that is limiting us in so many different ways. So, you know, there are a million things around, you know, the, the narrative construct.
There’s a lot of programs out there. I mean, you know, that’s what Tony Robins is built around. And if you haven’t done a Robin’s program, why not go do it? Right? I mean, what do you gotta lose? Uh, there’s value in all of those things. Um, if used properly nurtured correctly and integrated well, there can be value in all of that. And so, you know, when we look at the biology side, you look at like the trauma healers or the body work or the, um, you know, or understanding, you know, work around energy and, uh, really beginning to go back to understand, you know, where our minds exist. You know, how our limbic cluster is designed in a very primal state, right? Where it becomes our invisible radar that’s always out pinging the world, right? And then we now know scientific evidence that sensation occurs before thought.
You know, when we’re, when we experienced something, you know, we see something, hear something, feel something, something comes in through our senses, great feeling in the body, and then that feeling gets labeled somewhere, right? And so discomfort dysregulation, uh, may turn into anxiety or frustration or anger. Um, right. So it kind of starts to escalate from sensation to feeling to emotion to then motion or behavior, right? Or action. And so that’s where we’re getting to work. The regulation process. The same can be true in reverse. If we’re, if we’ve got a really bad narrative going on in our head, we’re beating the shit out of ourselves or we’re beating ourselves up or we don’t feel good about ourselves or whatever is there. You know that in that thought pattern and of itself can work in reverse, can trigger a sensation in the body that then gets labeled as a, you know, becomes a feeling, gets labeled as an emotion and then the action occurs.
You know, man, I don’t want to go to the gym today. I feel like crap, blah, blah, blah, sensation in the body, you know? Oh, I’m tired. Ah, right. Becomes an emotion, feeling, sadness, guilt, shame, whatever it might be, you know, lethargic, whatever’s there, right? We’re triggering something. And then what’s the action while we sit on the couch and we don’t go to the gym. So this is where we’re, all of this converges and you can’t have one without the other. That’s what I want you to know today, that there is a perception of a battle between psychology and biology. There’s a perception of a battle between understanding the thought patterns, the mind if you will, and the body itself. And you know, there’s resistance to, you know, really feeling the feelings in a lot of ways. Some programs out there, you know, will chop you off literally and be like, you shouldn’t feel anything.
Emotions are bad, emotions are useless, feelings are useless. You know, we don’t really care about feelings. Sorry that that’s a terrible thing to say because they are there and they exist and you know, you gotta be able to feel the feels man. You gotta be able to feel them. You gotta be able to, to, to say, you know, Hey, I feel like shit today or I feel really anxious today or I’m really frustrated at something. Like, just the acknowledgement of it, you know, is huge. And that’s where I feel like in previous contexts, you know, we’ve shut that down too much. Understand the operational impact of that the family impacted that. The life impact of that is whenever we are at conflict between our mind and our body. Whenever we are separating biology versus psychology, whenever we’re separating thought from emotion, whenever we’re creating any level of disconnect, we are taking ourselves away from the opportunity to be in flow, to be present to the conditions as they exist around us.
Anytime we’re doing that, we are actually harming our ability to perform the way that we need to perform or want to perform any given situation, you know, and performance can be being a great husband or father being a great wife or mother being a great son or daughter. All of it, all of it across the board. Anytime that we sit a separation of mind and body, anytime that we are not attuned to what is actually happening internally, it will impact us externally every time. Hands down, no questions asked. So part of this process is to get hyper vigilant in a way of for a while because then it will become natural of how do I feel and what am I thinking and what’s going on and are they working together or not? Because the only person that can ever answer that is you. The only person that can ever know what’s actually going on inside you is you.
And so, you know, don’t run away from how you feel right now. Don’t run away from the thoughts that are happening, like just be with them for a minute. Right? Just be with them for as they are occurring and allow the body to come back into sync, you know, and the things that support that. This is where, you know, breathwork is key. This is where setting up transitions, this is where all the things that we talk about, points of recovery, right? All of these kind of core things that we’ve laid out all at the end of the day is about aligning you in a process that brings you back here, now brings you back and available to what’s taking place. Um, cause that’s, I mean that’s where the money is. That’s where it really comes into play. And you know, at least having the knowledge around when your mind is racing and going off in a certain direction versus when it is operating in a way that supports you is huge.
Knowing this sensation, getting to F E this is where I feel like I’ve been able to come to you over these last month or so, two months, maybe even about the last three. Really getting into the body work side of things. I now operate in a way where I can feel the sensation early. Like I’m, I’m catching the sensation as it’s happening so that I can assess the surroundings and see if I need it or not. Is it, you know, is it coming on because of some past thing? Is it coming on because the situation calls for it, do I need it? Do I not? Will it help me right now or will it not? And be able to make that assessment and go with it or dump it right and be that, that flat about it. Um, it’s crazy. It’s actually been awesome in a lot of ways, but it’s only come when, you know, we’ve done this work.
I mean, I think for me it was early on, the mental models, the mental constructs, the, the talk therapy work, you know, the kind cognitive behavioral, you know, work around some ways looking at, you know, those perspectives. Then transitioning into a lot of work, you know, especially like on the range doing the meditation shoot, that’s all body work, right? That’s all, that’s all hyper presence, that’s triggering feelings of safety, you know, up through the heart into the brain. That’s it’s learning how to actually feel safe, um, and confident in yourself and understand what’s happening in your surroundings and how to get in touch with, you know, micro actions like the short moments of time as things occur and be hyper present to those. Um, and how that plays out in the body. And then how the body, when I talk about the body, you know, I’m talking about the physical body, you know, we’ll push back in ways or we’ll try to overpower things, you know, and where thought and body interact.
Um, crazy, awesome exploration over several years. Uh, watching this occur, watching these patterns occur, uh, and come out to understand a, wow, you know, if we’re not, we’re not settled in our body. You know, we talk about sitting in your own power, not power over anything, but like who my own ability, my own capability. That is a biological response. That is not a narrative. I want to say that one more time. Like understanding your own power is a biological awareness, not a cognitive awareness, not a conscious awareness point, right? It’s this settled. It’s this sense that is in you, right? It becomes embodied in you. And I think that’s really the difference between knowledge and wisdom. You know, wisdom resides in the body. The knowing, you know, how many times have you run an incident or gone somewhere or operated and you just know, you couldn’t articulate it.
You couldn’t lay it out. You just know, you know something’s wrong. You know something’s off. You know something’s going to happen, you know it’s going to go this way. Whatever you knew you knew in the body before, you could know in the mind you knew in the body. And that is wisdom. That is what wisdom looks like. Knowledge is great wisdom, real wisdom, you know, and that’s not like ancient sayings. That’s like really being wise in the body, listening to things in the body and then being able to allow the narrative to construct around that is huge, right? That’s winning. I mean that’s operating at a whole different level. That’s a whole different game right there when that’s dropping into flow. Because when we’re in that state, we have that sense something is pinging our radars, something is occurring that’s giving us signals that becomes familiar, that then creates a familiar sensation in the body that then we have to assess, right?
And if we’re present, we’re able to see what’s taking place, we’re able to read the conditions and then we can construct the narrative accordingly. You know, our thought process, our uh, you know, our checklist, our assessment and then our decision and our actions follow. And so that’s really where we, we get to when we start operating at the top of our game. And so that’s, you know, I don’t know where you fall on things. I don’t know where you’ve come from. If you’ve done some programs, uh, if you’ve done some different work that you felt has had value or you’ve done work that you’ve just felt like was crap or didn’t do anything. I’m curious. So, you know, again, these are part of the conversations that I would like to have at more depth that we can’t really have on a Tuesday and Thursday, you know, but yet that’s where I really want to begin to steer the, the Facebook group is to be able to have these conversations.
So if there’s work you’ve done or programs you’ve taken our classes you’ve sit in that have resonated with you, that you feel like have made a change or you know, you, you feel like talk therapies shit and you know, you haven’t gotten any value out of it or you know, you’ve taken somebody’s program and you know, you loved it or you felt like it did something for you, you know, I would really appreciate it if you would begin to come into the Facebook group and, and share those things, right. And then like, let’s learn from each other. Let’s talk about that stuff. Uh, cause I haven’t done everything and I don’t know everything, but, uh, you know, we’re all in this together. And I think what I seen from the messages coming back, I mean, it’s, we’re, we’re dealing with the same stuff day in and day out.
And this can be a great community and a great source for doing that. So I hope if you’re not already in there, uh, IOP, we’ll get into the Facebook group over at mindset radio, uh, and uh, join joining the conversation and don’t just come in the group to hang out, right? If you’re coming to the group, participate, uh, share something, uh, contribute to each other. Uh, there’s a lot of great stuff out there and there’s a lot of, a lot of, you do a lot of really good work. Um, so that needs to spread, right? We, we collectively, uh, are responsible for moving this conversation forward for elevating the game for ourselves and those around us. And we’re only gonna do that when we begin to really share and communicate effectively and begin to share tools and resources and things that have worked and things that have not worked, um, and be able to look at it.
So a lesson that’s going to be Thursday’s episode, we’re going to wrap this thing up here in about 30 minutes. Um, thanks for tuning back in. Thanks for staying with me. Uh, you know, we’re going to go through this more. Got a really interesting guest coming up in a couple of weeks. Uh, uh, with a new technology that came out last year, uh, had an opportunity to test it out. I’m just, you know, I’m an asshole around technologies, especially when they deal with a recovery, resiliency, hurray ability, performance, all that stuff. Like I’m a jerk around it cause there’s a lot of crap out there. Um, this is by far one of the best things that I’ve ever seen. And so, uh, Dave Rubin, Dave Raven from Apollo neuro is going to come on, uh, and share a little bit more about it. Uh, we’ve got a great discussion lined up with it.
It’s a pretty cool, pretty cool talk. Um, we’re going to be highlighting a few other people along the way through this month. Uh, so some good conversations. And then, uh, I think I decided to kind of move in a little different direction with the shows coming up. I’m going to intertwine, uh, kind of a four part series, uh, based off of our program I wrote a couple of years ago called the Preble journey, uh, which really looked at some of the big things that inhibit us, uh, constantly the things that really kind of take off software game or inhibit us to perform at a, at a whole new level. Uh, so we’re going to take that on an a and kind of a four part series, uh, intertwined with some other stuff. We’re going to have a lot of fun. We’re going to keep the show rocking and rolling. So I appreciate you listening.
Do me a favor, share the podcast out with your people in your community. Uh, you know, always, always send me some feedback. Hop into the Facebook group, uh, start participating. I think coming out of these last month, uh, I really want to cultivate us as a community. You’ve been great in sharing with me and I’d really like you to step in and start sharing with the community at large. And so, let’s not let let the Facebook group be dormant. Um, but just know that I’m, you know, doing my best to keep everything together. So hop in, start asking questions, start engaging. Uh, let’s get some community involvement and let’s, let’s build our own little tribe here around those of us that really want to operate at a different level. So thanks again for listening. Uh, and we’ll be back on Tuesday or yeah, next Tuesday. So glad to be back, stay safe, be great out there. Enjoy the rest of your day. Enjoy the crap out of your weekend and, uh, we’ll talk to you soon. Thanks.